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Are you ready to tap in to your power within so that your business can reach its truest potential? Hi, I’m Candice Hozza and I help business entrepreneurs access their inner GPS so that their business can grow and thrive. You are here to serve and to create an impact in this world. Welcome to The Intuitive Business Podcast.
Candice Hozza:
This is an interview between Candice and Carmen and right now what we’re talking about, I actually really want other women to know is about the difference between fierceness and anger and how that shows up in business. Today I want to introduce Carmen and I don’t have the script in front of me.
Carmen Hoffert:
We’re going off script.
Candice Hozza:
We’re going to off script and I’m going to let her introduce herself for the sake of time and for fluidity.
Carmen Hoffert:
Sure, my name is Carmen Hoffert and I love Candice, she’s amazing. Yeah, she’s great. I introduce myself, so I am the founder of Rebelle Lancaster. It’s a community for women, it’s inclusive so if you are a woman or identify as female, you’re welcome to join our community. We meet once a month and members enjoy just getting together and talking about topics that are meaningful to us.
Candice Hozza:
How do they get in touch with you?
Carmen Hoffert:
Well, we are on Instagram at Rebelle Lancaster, and we’re also online at rebellecon.com.
Candice Hozza:
Excellent. Excellent, so thank you for that information so let’s continue.
Carmen Hoffert:
Yeah.
Candice Hozza:
Let’s tell you what ended up happening. Carmen and I connected and I was invited to be a speaker when one of her speakers became second. It just really worked out well and it’s been such an incredible connection. The women and the group and Rebelle, it just felt like my tribe.
What we did is we did an interview on what intuition is, and we were about to begin that interview. She said, “How are you?” I said, “I’m not happy with myself,” and I wasn’t happy with myself because I managed about 22 properties over a course of time. That didn’t fit the identity of who I was anymore. What I feel my purpose is, is about consciousness, enlightenment, helping people. As Carmen said, talk about what you just said, because she gave a really great analogy about what I do to help other people and I never saw myself in that light.
Carmen Hoffert:
Yeah. I think that what you do is you are a slingshot, a loving slingshot. Imagine if Candice is sort of the actual slingshot and you are the ball or the rock or whatever it is. She just propels you in a really loving and graceful way to discover new things about yourself that you didn’t realize were there all along. You do that so well and with such grace.
Candice Hozza:
Oh thank you so much and what made you feel that? What gave you that vision?
Carmen Hoffert:
My intuition gave me that. Yup, absolutely, my intuition. When I was talking to you, that was the visual I got, was an actual slingshot and you embodying that, yeah.
Candice Hozza:
Here’s where we’re at today. Here’s what I did and here’s what I feel super bad about, is I was in a situation with real estate. When I started real estate about, I don’t know if it’s 12 or more years ago, I remember talking to people that were dealing in real estate and they were like, “Are you sure that person isn’t doing this or that?” Pretty soon I was learning that in real estate it is a dog eat dog world. The realtors have been interesting to deal with, brokers have been interesting, a challenge to deal with, some brokers, some have been amazing.
What it does is it triggers something inside of me and it made me feel bad that I had to push somebody to the point of I accused them of lying. There was a whole bunch of things going on that weren’t adding up and I thought that they were playing me for a fool basically, which was my ego, first of all. I performed with the energy of anger and I’m really frustrated because I feel I’m like a spiritual leader now and a teacher. Pushing anger into the world in any situation, even if I was being conned in that moment, anger was not the tool or the energy to use and that’s what I did.
The challenge with me using anger was that I had a kind relationship with this person, and because of what I learned in the past, I brought that into that moment and in the future. I was embarrassed about my behavior and I didn’t even sleep well last night. I hit the counter. I didn’t even sleep well last night because of this. When Carmen’s like, “How are you?” I feel I’m a pretty genuine person and I was like, “I don’t feel good because of this.” Then here’s where we hit record, and I want Carmen to share what it is about women and anger versus her thoughts, and I’ll let her go from there.
Carmen Hoffert:
Yeah. Well, first of all I want to say in response to what you just said is thank you. Thank you. I’m going to get a little emotional, but you being super vulnerable and saying, “I,” I know we’re getting emotional over here.
Candice Hozza:
Both of us.
Carmen Hoffert:
You are a spiritual teacher in so many ways to so many women and men and all your clients and all of it, but you also are human. You saying, “Oh crap, I lead with anger,” and then being able to voice it and not only voice it, record it and send it out to all of your listeners is huge. It shows us that we are all still on our journeys, still learning and applying the tools that we have to continually do that every day, no matter who we are. I just want to say thank you.
Candice Hozza:
Thank you. Thank you and thank you for holding space for me, because I didn’t know who I was going to talk to about this. To be honest, I wouldn’t have recorded this and made this into a podcast. I wouldn’t have wanted people to see me in the light of accusing somebody of lying to me. The sad part that really hurts me is they were having a rough day, like their movers didn’t come and I didn’t believe them. I thought they were stalling moving from the property, which has happened to me and they’ve taken refrigerators and stoves and it’s cost a small fortune, but I hadn’t had that relationship with this person.
There were some things that were off I will give it that, but that did not give me the permission. I literally like attacked her with this accusatory language and I was angry with her. It made me so frustrated and I felt embarrassed, I was embarrassed and I let my own self down by letting her down. She was struggling. She was having a hard day. She doesn’t have good health and her movers didn’t show up and I accused her of stalling.
I go over to the property and the movers were like, “Yeah, we’re really sorry we weren’t here the day before.” She was telling the truth and she really liked me. I had done her a favor and then she said, I threw that up in her face. I did not perform in a good fashion and I don’t think I would have recorded this.
Carmen Hoffert:
Well, I love that. I love you, I think you’re awesome. I think that there, as you know, in your life there’s always that opportunity to use this experience, to deepen the relationship that you even have with her. You allowing yourself to show some vulnerability there. We were chatting about the difference between being angry or anger and fierce. How women often, we don’t know the difference between being angry and calling up our fierceness because often in the world and in our lives, we are told to be the good girls. The stuff it down, hold it in, show up kindly, sweetly and all of these different ways that it’s hard for us to really sort of tap into that place of being fierce. When I say fierce I mean like mama bear, so those moments where somebody’s like doing your kid dirty or whatever, and it just comes out and that’s fierce.
We were sort of chatting about what the difference is there, and I’ve been learning this in my life and I’ve been learning … I just read a really, really beautiful article on it and discussed it with some really intelligent women just over the weekend. As we were kind of like diving into what that difference is, I think that you taking responsibility in this story and saying like, “Oh crap, I definitely could have taken a moment to discern it in a different way and now that I know I did lead with anger. I was trying to be fierce, but I was also replaying all of the past trauma that had happened to me before. Someone else stalled, someone else said their movers didn’t show up. Someone else stole from me. I was taken advantage of and so I’ve learned to protect that part of me.”
While you came at this woman from a place of anger, you were still protecting that past Candice who had been taken advantage of, and you just wanted to make sure that that wasn’t happening again. I think now that you know, you have a really beautiful opportunity to deepen the relationship and the trust between your past tenant, right?
Candice Hozza:
Yeah.
Carmen Hoffert:
And you.
Candice Hozza:
Well, I actually thought about that. I thought, “I’m going to take them,” I mean, they’re still in the middle of a move. I’m going to take them a meal of some sort, and then her some flowers. There were some things there though that were challenged, but in the same token … What I was thinking about, so I was going to sleep and I was thinking forgiveness is another issue that I have issues with.
Okay, now I know I did something wrong and now it’s time for me to step up. Now I’m really, I’m stuck. Now I’m not saying I’m not going to do it, but I was thinking, “How could I make this better?” I also barked down my husband’s throat that same day with like anger. He said, “You have these anger things that are coming out,” and I thought, “Hmm, here I am trying to teach people to be unstuck,” and I realized I have some anger issues that I need to let go of. That once I do, I believe that the next level of me will evolve.
It’s not about me, it’s about what I can do for others, but I can’t teach others when I have this brokenness around this issue. Yes, I’m going to continue to teach, but now that I’m aware, I have to transition that and be in integrity.
Carmen Hoffert:
Well, and I think you’re exactly right, but I think that we are always teacher and student. While you are teaching other people, the only reason and the only way you’re able to teach other people, is because you’re putting in the work. You’re putting in the work in your own life, you’re calling yourself into awareness to say, “Whoa, I barked down my husband’s throat. I took anger out on someone else.” The only reason that you’re able to then provide this insight to others is because you recognize it in your own life and you’re doing the work.
I think to follow up on something that you said, you had said, forgiveness is something that you struggle with. I would even say, perhaps look at the forgiveness that you need to give yourself, because when did this happen? It’s Monday, this happened yesterday?
Candice Hozza:
Yeah.
Carmen Hoffert:
Okay, so in that time you said that you haven’t been sleeping well, you feel sad, you got emotional. This happened yesterday, but you’re still torturing and punishing yourself for a mistake that any of us could’ve made and you’re still letting yourself be punished by it.
Candice Hozza:
Yeah, and even by saying, “But it happened in the past,” that’s just a justification and I don’t like that. I don’t like that energy so I have to forgive me first.
Carmen Hoffert:
Yeah and say, “Oh crap, that happened and I didn’t like the way I handled it. I didn’t like my reaction. I didn’t take a second to breathe. I have all of these tools and next time I’ll do that.”
Candice Hozza:
You know what else I didn’t use?
Carmen Hoffert:
What?
Candice Hozza:
Well, what I was using instead of my intuition was the past pain. I was connecting to the time that somebody took our stove and dishwasher and every appliance out of the house and didn’t tell us they moved. I was going back to those bad things in my head and what my business is called is The Intuitive Business and I wasn’t using that skill instead. I knew as I was doing it, I said, “This is your ego. This is your ego,” and my ego picked up the phone and I was like, “No, I don’t want to use my ego.” My ego’s like, “Oh hell yeah,” and guess what? My ego really screwed up.
Carmen Hoffert:
No, your ego didn’t screw up.
Candice Hozza:
What did my ego do?
Carmen Hoffert:
Your ego did what every ego does, your ego answered the call. This is my ego. This is my ego. I’m picking up the phone for the ego. The ego is just going to do what the ego always does. Yeah.
Candice Hozza:
What if I would have played with my intuition instead in that moment?
Carmen Hoffert:
What would have happened?
Candice Hozza:
What would have happened differently?
Carmen Hoffert:
Maybe that’s also where you need to forgive yourself is, yeah what if I would have done it differently, but I didn’t, and so I will next time. Then I will know what would have happened differently because I will have used my intuition.
Candice Hozza:
For all of you listening out there, what is it in your life and in your business that you need to let go of? Is it your anger because of past hurts? Is it that you have a hard time forgiving others or forgiving yourself?
Carmen Hoffert:
That is a good question. I’m trying to think, what would I want to let go of? Well, I definitely do what you do. Something will happen and I will mull over it and work through it and try it, or I think I’m working through it, but really what I’m doing is just replaying it in my head. I’m like, “I’m processing.” No, you’re just working it through in your head over and over and over again, so that would be mine.
I’m really working towards forgiving myself in those moments and understanding that, going back to the Maya, Angelou, Dr. Maya Angelou quote, when you know better, you do better. Now you experienced that, you’ll move forward and the next time that that happens, you’ll have this experience to pull from and I know you will.
Candice Hozza:
Say that again.
Carmen Hoffert:
I know will.
Candice Hozza:
I love it, say it again.
Carmen Hoffert:
Dr. Maya Angelou said, when you know better, you do better. You pull from the experience, you say, “Oh, that one isn’t great. I wish I would have handled that differently. Next time I’ll pull from this experience and I’ll do better because I know.”
Candice Hozza:
That feels so much better. Even just talking about this feels so much better because I kept it inside. What are you keeping inside right now? What is that thing? I love the word that Carmen used that was festering, what an awful word and a such a great word because it was eating me up. When I looked into her eyes and she said, “How are you today?” Before we hit record or before we even talked about what we’re going to talk about, when I looked into her eyes, I just felt like I needed also to be honest.
Here’s what’s really ironic about this whole situation. Carmen was here before and we thought we recorded something about intuition, and it was really awesome and something went wrong with my machine. It’s the only time that it hasn’t recorded and then we finally got ourselves back around to today. Here we are really talking about intuition, but in a way that I didn’t expect, but what if we start listening? I just felt like she and I, our hearts were connected in this subject, fierceness and anger for women. What we’ve been taught and what we need to bring more of into the world is who we really are from, what? What do you think it is?
Carmen Hoffert:
Well, I think that even just trusting our intuition is really, really, really important. It’s something that I’ve been leaning into in the past several years and trusting myself that I know the answers. Or if I don’t know the answer, if I’m really not sure, to create a team of really trusted, beautiful advisors who know your soul and know your heart so deeply, that they can kind of help you see the way and guide you into making decisions. It’s all about intuition, discernment and just being able to walk in that, that’s been my experience.
Candice Hozza:
That brings us to this very moment of what Carmen and I stepped into, is we trusted even the subject matter that was going to come out. This wasn’t where we were going, but I felt into the moment and I’m like, this is what high performing women business entrepreneurs that are delivering a message out into the world. What if you’re struggling? What if there’s a pain point that’s keeping you up at night, that’s festering about something inside of you and how can you release that? I love this topic about forgiveness and about listening to our own intuition.
Carmen Hoffert:
Yeah. I’m trying to find it right now as we speak. There’s a really beautiful piece on Instagram about the difference between processing emotions, which is something that you and I talked about and ruminating on emotions and experiences. This is actually from a beautiful woman on Instagram, it’s at Therapy For Women on Instagram. She’s a professional and she sort of outlines the difference between processing emotions and ruminating, and that which is kind of what I was saying I do.
I think, “Oh I’m processing, I’m processing,” and no, I’m just replaying that over and over and over again and also not trusting my intuition to say, “No girl, you’re human. That was an oops. That was a mistake. How do we make it right? How do we learn from it and continue on so that, that pain or that confusion isn’t wasted?” Does that make sense?
Candice Hozza:
Yes, it does and so what I did last night when I was struggling is, I pulled one of my cards and let me see if I can find what it says. I pulled one of my cards last night and because I was struggling so much and I needed some internal guidance. I’m going to see if I can find what it said, because it was really, really cool. I felt really connected. There’s these cards I use, I don’t see them sitting here.
Carmen Hoffert:
Is it the Rebels?
Candice Hozza:
The Rebel.
Carmen Hoffert:
Yeah, Sacred Rebels, I saw it over there. Yeah.
Candice Hozza:
Do you realize, so Rebelle is her group.
Carmen Hoffert:
Yeah, and then I was in here and I just happened to glance over and she has her cards and it’s from the deck Sacred Rebels.
Candice Hozza:
Here’s what really, really hit me last night when I read this card. The energy around this matter is relevant to your secret birthright and sign. Perhaps you need to trust more to know that all is well, no matter what happens or what appears to be. And to ask for help and believe that you deserve to receive it. Like why didn’t I say, “Hey, guides, help me out. Is this person trying to con me?” Why wouldn’t I ask? I just went with boom, anger.
This goes back to the cards, the Rebel cards or Sacred Rebel, I’m sorry. The legacy of light can also ask you to call on the unconditional love and support that exists for you every day. The light will offer you all manner of assistance. Do not call upon it like you’re starving because you believe you have no means to acquire food whilst a few days late before your eyes, if only you would partake of it.
Basically it was just saying, “Abundance is around you,” and I was thinking in lack. This card also talked about something about once this is healed, because what I really like about the Sacred Rebel cards is they also put the component of healing. It says like, once this is healed, basically I will transition into the next level. That light and bringing light into the world is my sacred gift, and this anger that I had also can be transformed into passion because I’m a very passionate person and that’s one of my gifts. Sometimes it’s that double edged sword, like the gift and the curse, right?
Carmen Hoffert:
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I don’t believe that anger is bad or a bad emotion. Anger is simply an emotion that’s trying to tell you something. In this case with your experience yesterday, that anger was just trying to say like, “I’ve been through this before. Let’s check this out to make sure that it isn’t the same experience that you already had.” It’s just a little tap on the shoulder to say, “Let’s investigate this further. Let’s get curious and ask some more questions or ask your guides.”
Candice Hozza:
So because I didn’t plan on us going down this road, I kind of feel a little lost to where else to go. I do just want to stay in this one moment of, as women we didn’t learn this stuff. I’m quite a lot older than you, I think we’re probably 15 years apart, something like that. I’m 59.
Carmen Hoffert:
Oh I’m 38.
Candice Hozza:
38, so about 20, wow, damn. We should do a whole next show on aging, but even with that being said, so we have a 20 year age gap and I didn’t learn how to manage my anger. Carmen at almost 40 or at the end of her 30s, she didn’t learn how to manage that. She’s probably more, has a lot more freedom and visions of freedom than I did as a woman.
Like everybody in our neighborhood, maybe except, no, I can’t think, nope. Everybody in our neighborhood, the woman worked or stayed at home and the father worked. Everybody lived off of a salary that was basically a steelworker’s salary because that’s where I lived. Whether you had five kids or you had two kids, everybody’s house was pretty much the same, you just fit more people into that same unit and that’s how people lived.
I didn’t get to see different things in my environment. Everybody was pretty much doing the same thing, staying at home, raising their children. I knew that I wanted to have a career because something inside me told me and I kind of think … I always had two things. I always had the baby buggy and the machine gun, and I don’t use guns or anything like that. It was the Vietnam war and I would have my helmet and I’d get a football and a baby doll. I always think my dad, because in the beginning I was an only child and then my sister came along, it was 10 years later.
I think he always stretched my masculine side. “Come and learn how to fix the car because you could be stuck on a road Candice.” Then he’d put military rations in the back of the trunk and a woolen blanket and water and a spray and wash type of thing for the windows, as well as paper towels. I was good to go and in the winter there were sandbags and a mini shovel.
Carmen Hoffert:
Aw, but you’re right. Well, and that’s how we all are made, right? We all are the feminine and the masculine and we just are learning to sort of balance those out. I think now you have been called into a feminine space if I’m correct.
Candice Hozza:
Yeah.
Carmen Hoffert:
I don’t want to answer for you, but I would feel that way too about myself, but yeah, we’re figuring it out in a balance of both.
Candice Hozza:
The last month had been quite of a challenge in real estate because some of the properties and most I did not. You get pushed and shoved around on both sides and I found myself being not happy with that. It was making me somebody who I wasn’t, or I shouldn’t say, it made me feel like I was losing my power. The way I feel about my business, like when I went to speak at Rebelle, they had a professional photographer that I’m going to actually hire for my Spirit Spa Day, right after …
Carmen Hoffert:
Megan Hopper Photography.
Candice Hozza:
.com.
Carmen Hoffert:
Yeah.
Candice Hozza:
I’m actually going to meet with her literally after this appointment, I’m going to go over to …
Carmen Hoffert:
Really?
Candice Hozza:
Yeah. I’m going to …
Carmen Hoffert:
Oh I love her.
Candice Hozza:
I’m going to text her and we’re going to meet.
Carmen Hoffert:
Give her a hug for me.
Candice Hozza:
Oh, I will. Yeah, she gave you a hug.
Carmen Hoffert:
I know, return it.
Candice Hozza:
Here’s where we are, hugging and you know what, that’s my highest and best. Like this connection, this giggle-ness. I worked in a hard profession. I worked at a university for 33 years and then the real estate for about 12 years, and that would often put me in my masculine energy. I’m moving the desk down because I’m realizing like we’re both stretching into this mic because we’re shorter and I have my desk too high.
It made me take a step back and say, “What brings me joy in my life?” Real estate can bring you some really good money, but it wasn’t bringing me joy and I needed to make a decision. What I did is, I retired from managing properties and instead I’m going to put that time into something I love, that brings me joy. Now even saying that makes me feel kind of feminine and soft, but yet I’m not a soft person. I’m not a weak person and sometimes softness, here’s another good word, softness and weakness. Being soft and in your flowy, feminine energy is a whole different thing than when you’re pushing and pushing.
Carmen Hoffert:
I would even take that one bit further because you’re saying, “I want to be in my joy. I want to be doing what feels right for me and that feels soft, but is that weak?” I would say that you moving into that “soft” space is actually empowering you, which is the opposite of weak.
Candice Hozza:
I love that, empowerment.
Carmen Hoffert:
Yeah and I also wanted to circle back to something else that you said about our age differences and say that, I’m going to speak for folks my age. For us, for me looking to you, I didn’t even know how old you were. Being able to see you live a life and create a life that is fulfilling and empowering to you so that you can then empower others is really beautiful. It’s really neat for us to be able to see that and to hear your story of where you came from and that you didn’t have that to look to. Even though you didn’t have it to look to, that you’re creating it so that we can. That’s really, I just want to thank you for that.
Candice Hozza:
We’re hugging and I have goosebumps.
Carmen Hoffert:
It’s true. It really is true and that’s the connection. That’s the universal connection. That’s why we’re all connected. We don’t even realize it and we are.
Candice Hozza:
Wow, and for those of us that are at the end of our 50s, maybe 60s, maybe even 70s, some of the people I work with are in their 70s and they’re still going really strong. I don’t see any end to what they’re doing and they’re making huge contributions.
Carmen Hoffert:
They’re just getting started.
Candice Hozza:
They’re just getting started. At my Pivot to Profit, there’s a lot of women on my group Pivot to Profit and you can check out my website for that where groups of women come in and they ask questions. I go into the intuitive side of myself and somehow we got on the track of aging and boobs. It was like talking about how the boobs are now slipping out underneath the bra and poor, poor Renee he was at one of the interviews that you listen to and he’s a guy. He was there, but you know, I’m looking at the physical symptoms of aging.
It’s a little bit slower getting out of the bed, and things hurt in the morning for a while sometimes and sometimes it’s a good morning. I’ve had surgeries and health issues and I feel great right now, but when you get to this age, you start looking at this body that you’re hosting with your spirit. You know that, let’s face it, even these beautiful women in their 70s, okay, if we have 100 years to live, how many of those years are going to be great? You start at this age evaluating where you’re spending your time and how you’re spending your time, because there is a limit to how many years we have on this earth in this lifetime. I believe the soul’s ageless and that it never dies, and that these are experiences that I’m going to be taking to the next incarnation of who I’m going to become. I really want them to be great.
What I think that I can contribute to this world, and I never thought about it like this, is for women who are of my age, that they’re looking at stepping into another age. Sometimes it’s so hard when you look in the mirror and so many of the things that used to look like you don’t, and that’s not really what’s important anymore. It’s the wisdom that I’ve learned through my experiences in each one of those wrinkles and marks and everything that’s on my body now and everything that’s not on my body now. I’m looking at it in a different light with what Carmen just said is, I have something more to offer than my wrinkles.
Carmen Hoffert:
Absolutely. You are your light. You are and I just feel really lucky to get to know you, I like to be here with you. I’m lucky.
Candice Hozza:
Wow, thank you so much for that. I think that this is kind of a good natural ending. Remember, I just want you to lean into what we’re talking about today and maybe spend a little time with yourself. A lot of people listen to these recordings while they’re in the car and so this is a really good time. You’re probably by yourself and to ask yourself, what is it right now that if you released it, maybe that anger, or maybe worrying about the wrinkles or how your boobs keep slipping out underneath your bra and thinking about what we have to offer to this world, what thoughts can we let go of and behaviors? In their place, what are you going to choose to free up and bring into the world? Thank you for being with us today.
Carmen Hoffert:
Thank you, it was so fun.
Candice Hozza:
Tell them one more time, how they can get in touch with you.
Carmen Hoffert:
Oh yes, Rebelle is the name of the community and we are at Rebelle Lancaster on Instagram and rebellecon.com online.
Candice Hozza:
Thank you.
Thank you for tuning into this episode. I hope that you feel more connected to your power within and that you take action from the guidance here today. For more information, please head to candicehozza.com, where you will find more resources to help you and your business grow to the next level.